So all of those are in the background. I do think that one of the things we have to keep in mind is absolute debt doesn’t necessarily have to go down as EBITDA grows and we reduce debt a little bit, that obviously -- what we are really fixated on more than anything is the absence of leverage ratio, not the absolute dollar amount of debt necessarily, but we do want to have a better ratio.
Todd Duvick - Bank of America/Merrill Lynch
Okay, that’s helpful. And just one follow-up. Mike, it sounds like, you know, within the past couple of years, I’ve heard some frustration on your part, or maybe I just interpret it that way, with the rating agencies. It sounds like you are renewing a commitment to really try and work toward that mid-triple B from S&P. Am I interpreting that correctly?
J. Michael Schlotman
We think in this environment, it would be very helpful for us to be A2, P2, F2 and be able to access that commercial paper market rather than the unrated market. I think we’ve had the commitment all along. Obviously the thing that’s been the wildcard in this is the amount of the un-funded (inaudible) obligation or the estimate of the amount that they are under-funded by, even though it’s not a direct obligation. And as Rodney said, we do believe in the transparency of putting that number out there and it’s bounced all around the place and the size of it right now is probably the thing that was more of a headwind than we would have estimated two years ago.
Todd Duvick - Bank of America/Merrill Lynch
Okay. That’s very helpful. Thank you very much. Have a good day.
David B. Dillon
Thank you, Todd.
Operator
The next question comes from the line of Neil Currie representing UBS. Please proceed.
Neil Currie – UBS
Good morning. I just want to talk about eating at home trends and how you are benefiting from people eating out at restaurants less. Obviously private label tends to move up during tough times and tends to be quite sticky. Do you think we may be able to see that in private -- in eating at home trends and people eating out at restaurants and shopping at supermarkets more as the economy does level out or maybe shows some improvement, that some of this market share growth from restaurants that you might be seeing could be sticky?
David B. Dillon
Well, I believe that that would be correct. We are still seeing the trend of families eating a little less at restaurants and a little more from us. Part of that is driven simply by where they can get the less expensive meal and part of it is driven by improvements that we’ve made in our own deli and meals that are ready to take home and eat, the combination of which -- I mean, we’ve commented that bakery/deli was one of the areas that has improved in sales above our average and that’s been true now for some time. That’s a reflection of the better job that we are doing.
Now, on the flip side, restaurants are doing actually a better job in trying to develop more of their pick-up meals at the restaurants to take home, trying to get some lower priced point items. Those I think could get a little bit of traction but I still don’t expect any big change here, other than the continued trend. And as the recession ends and the economy improves, because of the improved quality job we’ve done in our delis, I fully expect to retain some of that -- maybe not all but I certainly expect to retain some, and the same would be true of the Kroger brand, just as you described.
W. Rodney McMullen
The other thing, and this was the trend we thought we were seeing even before the economy slowed down, people are starting to eat at home more together as a family and when we do our research, customers certainly tell us they enjoy eating together as a family and there’s been quite a bit of research done where people that eat together as a family and Columbia did a great study on this, kids have a much lower rate of being involved in drugs or abusing alcohol and things like that. So we really think that was a fundamental trend going on, even outside of the economy.
Neil Currie – UBS
Thanks, and obviously setting up the bottom end of the ladder when it comes to when people do eat out less or trade down, you are very much a high quality operator. However, while on the one hand you are gaining market share from restaurants, I presume that there are some customers who are going to super centers, dollar stores, limited assortment discounters. What’s your confidence that that trend won’t be sticky as the economy recovers and you can get back some of those shoppers who are really struggling financially and going, compromising some quality and going to lower end retailers?
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